From: khyron@total.net (Eytan Kaziberdov) Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.reviews Subject: REVIEW: CyberVision 64/3D and Scandoubler Followup-To: comp.sys.amiga.graphics Date: 17 Sep 1998 10:37:18 -0400 Organization: The Amiga Online Review Column - ed. Daniel Barrett Lines: 376 Sender: barrett@belvedere.cs.umass.edu Message-ID: <6tr6qu$1hn@belvedere.cs.umass.edu> Reply-To: khyron@total.net (Eytan Kaziberdov) Keywords: hardware, graphics, commercial X-Review-Number: Volume 1998 Number 3 NNTP-Posting-Host: belvedere.cs.umass.edu X-NNTP-Posting-Host: belvedere.cs.umass.edu Path: rcfnews.cs.umass.edu!not-for-mail PRODUCT NAME: CyberVision 64/3D and Scandoubler DESCRIPTION: A Graphics Card, and Separate addon *Scandoubler For the Amiga and Compatible Line of Computers *ScanDoubler is only for the A4000 Series Video Slot. COMPANY INFO: Phase5 Digital Products In Der AU 27 D-61440 Oberursel Germany TEL: +49 (0) 61 71 628455 HTTP://WWW.PHASE5.DE LIST PRICE: CyberVision64/3D $330.00 Canadian Scandoubler $160.00 Canadian Total $490.00 Canadian Or $380.00 USD HARDWARE/SOFTWARE REQUIREMENTS: CyberVision64/3D Any Amiga/Clone With a Compatible Zorro Slot II/III 68020 Minimum, 68030 or Better Recomended 2MB FAST Ram Minimum, 8MB+ Recomended Amiga OS 3.0 or Better 3-4MB of Hard Drive Space ScanDoubler An A4000 VideoSlot WILL NOT WORK IN A2000/3000 Video Slot TECHSPECS: CYBERVISION 64/3D: 135MHz RamDac 4MB EDO RAM Zorro II/Zorro III AutoDetecting Resolution of 1280X1024@75Hz NonInterlace 1600X1200 Interlace 64Bit Internal/RAM DataPaths MPEG1 Decoder Addon Module SCANDOUBLER: ScanDoubles Standard NTSC/PAL to VGA Compatible Frequencies, All other ScreenModes are Passed through Only Functions In A4000 Video Slot COMPUTERS USED: C=/A4000 Desktop MC68040/33 Clocked at 30Mhz in A3640 Board. 2MB CHIP 16MB Fast WB3.1/KS3.1 1.6GB HD IDE, 16X CDROM ATAPI IDE C=1950 Monitor C=/A3000 Desktop MC68040/25 Clocked at 25Mhz in A3640 Board 2MB SCDIP CHIP, 16MB SCZIP FAST WB3.1/KS3.1 (Buster-07, DMA-02, RAMSY-04 All works Fine!) 500MB HD SCSI, 2X CDROM SCSI A2286 BridgeBoard ZII ViewSonic 17g Monitor C=/A2000 MC68030/68882 Both at 25Mhz 1MB CHIP, 4MB FAST (2MB 32BIT FAST, 4MB 16BIT FAST) WB3.1/KS3.1 (KS1.3 on Switcher) A2091 HD/2MB ZII, A2052 2MB CARD ZII 120MB HD SCSI, 42MB HD AT IDE Commodore 2080 Monitor NOTE: I used the Viewsonic17G on ALL the Machines to do the Testing. INTRODUCTION: The CV64/3D (CyberVision64/3d) is a graphics card for the Amiga line of computer with a Zorro Slot, It is Both Zorro II (16 Bit Slot Found in A2000, Most A1200 Tower Kits) and Zorro III (32 bit Found in A3000/4000 and very few A1200 Tower Kits) If you have a Zorro II expansion Hack on your A1000/500 (Bodega Bay, Xetec, Phoenix, HomeMade) you should contact them to see if it will work. The SD (Scandoubler Module) is a simple frequency doubler, and video selector device. In english this means, the SD takes the Amiga NTSC/PAL Video signal, and doubles it's Frequency So any VGA Monitor can View it. This DOES NOT FIX THE FLICKER when you are in interlace mode. It also serves as an automatic switch between CV64/3D Output and Standard Amiga output, thus letting you use only one monitor on your system. The SD ONLY FUNCTIONS IN A 100% compatible A4000 Video slot. I work in the Harware Applications Lab of a Leading PC Graphics card manufacturer, Logic Analyzers, DSO's, VHDL, etc.. are a second nature to me, so installing a video card should be a Joke... But.. I Bought the card in July of 1997, and due to certain reasons you will read about, stopped using it about October of that year, I did the review because there weren't any, so the A4000/A2000 part is the original expirience, and the A3000 was done rescently. I'm separating this to the individual computers, but make sure you read all of this it covers some important information. HARDWARE INSTALL: THE A4000 W/CYBERVISION64/3D and SCANDOUBLER Opening the A4000 is simple take out the mouse and joystick and remove two screws in the rear and the case slides off. The set the jumpers on the SD card to the proper setting, this is made complicated because of the manual, I will get to this later on.. The CV64/3D and SD Module are 2 separate parts the fit into the same slot, they are only held together by the metal backplane and a small ribbon cable. There is a 4mm gap between the two cards. Now here is where the problem begins. The card has to be installed as one unit, which is almost imposible, when you try to insert the card, the scandoubler doesn't have enough force on it, and doesn't want to go into the Video Slot, from this point I had tried using a large flat head screwdriver to force in the scandoubler, but it would just not fit. I only had two ways to go, either disassemble the entire A4000 and built the CV64/3D in place, then assemble the computer around it.. or find a way to fix the two cards together out side so they act as one solid card. To make a real long story short, I ended up taking on of the plastic guides from the A4000 case (these are the brown plasitc holders on the Zorro Slots that hold the end of the card that's on the front side of the amiga.) I snipped off both it's ends and fitted it between the two parts, and then used 4 drops of Crazy Glue to hold it in place. Well the board still didn't go in easily, it took way too much force, the last problem was that the bords needed to have an angle shaved into them on either side of the fingers, because they were too perfect a fit. I turned on the computer, and there was no video output. I rechecked the scandoubler's jumpers, and even began to follow the ciruit, and saw that they were set fine. I removed the two parts and installed the scandoubler on it's own and reset the jumpers. Still there was no video, the Amiga's output was giving video as it was expected. I then removed it again and went over the jumpers to be sure that they were okay, and when I went to install it again my finger nail pulled of a SMT capacitor (not to mention my finger nail split in half...PAIN!), after 20 Miniutes of dancing around, yelling, and bleeding.. I decided it was time to give up, and go to the dealer. The dealer is a friend of mine, but because of the broken cap, and a trace was pulled from the board he couldn't exchange it. After calculating cost of shipping repair etc.. I just ordered another one, since having this one repaired/shipped would have cost close to the amount of a new unit. 4 Weeks later... I installed the unit and everything went just fine this time, the software went in okay etc. Just there was one problem, I had a color bleed on the red signal from any mode that was being scandoubled, this made PAL/NTSC completely useless. Three Emails to Phase5 Tech support resulted in No response. I contacted them by phone, and they said it was defective and to return it. I returned it to my dealer who got another one less than 2 Days later, it suffered from the exact same problem, and the supplier had no more in stock and would have to order, which would take anywhere from 6-8Weeks. I was frustrated and took it anyways.. THE A3000 With ONLY CyberVision64/3D: This was very strait forward, I installed the card and software it went quite well. The scandoubler DOES NOT WORK with the A3000 or A2000 VideoSlot so you'd have to use two monitors or a monitor switchbox.. THE A2000 With ONLY CyberVision64/3D: This had a few problems, first I was left with only 2MB of Config Space which shouldn't be a problem the manual says the card should only config 2MB in this senario, this was not the case I had to remove 2MB of ram to get the card to show up as working In the Boot Menu Diagnostics. Same as before The scandoubler DOES NOT WORK with the A3000 or A2000 VideoSlot so you'd have to use two monitors or a monitor switchbox.. SOFTWARE INSTALL: _________________ The Software install is pretty strait forward it uses the standard INSTALLER, just make sure you read the manual once over before you install the software, as well when you are being asked the questions read them carefully, some of them are phrased in a negative sense. The Board Comes with the CyberGraphx V3 RTG/API, which an excellent peice of software it's very bugfree, take a look at HTTP://www.vgr.com for more info. The Only Issue was with the A2000, I had to use enforcer in the Startup-Sequence to get the card to work properly. but this usually happens with 020' and 030's. The Software has a Picture Viewer, MPEG Player, and a few Demo's Showing off the 3D capailities of the S3 Virge3D chip. FUNCTIONALITY: The CyberVision64/3D part of the combination worked flawlessy. It Had a Crisp and Clean Picture right up to 1600X1200 on my Viewsonic 17G. There was no real noticeable Speed Differences in 8/16/24Bit, running workbench (moving windows around etc..), on all the Amigas. This is mainly because most of the hard work is blitter related, and very little bus activity. Of course you can easily expect a speed decrease on the Zorro II VS Zorro III when playing back an animation, a game etc.. This is just the "nature of the bus", and would be expected with any card. On The A4000 there was only a slight improvement,about 15-20%, in games running in 320X200 8Bpp with CyberGraphics VS AGA, My guess is that if I had an '060 it would be a larger improvement. The A3000 performed almost Identically to the A4000, but of course without any sort of signal switcher I had to resort to phsically switching the monitor cable to the ECS output when I went to play an old game, or needed the Boot Menu. As a side Note my Viewsonic monitor has 2 inputs which you select from the front panel, this would be a nice workaround for the lack of a switcher if you have a scandoubler/FlickerFixer. The CyberVision64/3D has a 3D Virge 3D Chip, this chip contains ALL the nessary 3D functions, but this chip is SLOW in the 3D department. Still any help to the processor will add a few FPS in a game, unfortunately there's almost no software that supports it. So far I've only seen Tornado3D, ADescent, and I'm not too sure but CyberGL might support it by now.. DOCUMENTATION/SUPPORT: This documentaion is poor, it seems as though it was written by someone who knows the hardware very well, and therefore takes for granted all the simple steps to install the card. In the Scandoubler Manual the jumper Setting Table is very confusing, but this seems like more of a german to english translation problem. I rescently gave my brother my A2000 to replace his dead A1000, and I gave him the Cybervision 64/3D, I remebered to tell him to remove the 2MB ram before installing the video card, but I forgot to tell him about enforcer. He's a programmer on X86 Boxes. He spent about 3 Hours trying to figure out what Enforcer was, until he called me and asked what it is... This is a very good point on how the documentation suffers. Enforcer was sitting on the install disk, yet he had no clue what he was looking for. Was it a Harware addon? Was it a software patch? A few extra lines in the manual describing how to install it would have helped. Phase5 Makes Excellent Hardware, but their technical support is horrible. Their Manual points you to their website for support, and all you can find there is a few outdated problems or solutions for the CyberStorm MK2. LIKES/DISLIKES: The CyberVision64/3D is an excellent video card It performs extremely well, while it was installed in my computer it worked perfect. The Image quality was good even at 1600X1200, there was very little ghosting or bleeding. It comes with the CyberGfx V3 which I also find to be an excellent product, and is very proven product. Since the Scandoubler only works on the A4000, there should have been a switcher module created for the A2000/3000 etc. computer that allow a passthough of the video, since an external video switchbox will seriously degrade the image quality, as well many people have good MultiSync monitors that can do 15Khz, or FlickerFixer Boards and don't see a need to buy another monitor. I consider this the worst flaw of the card. The 3D support is non-existant and should have been pushed harder by Phase5. WARANTY: Both the Cybervision63/3D and ScanDoubler Have a 12Month Parts and Labour Warranty (From Date of Purchase), against defective workmanship.. CONCLUSION: ___________ You can see a theme from what I wrote, there is one key issue that would put me off recomending the card, and two other issues that are only applicable under certain conditions, or point of view. Very Serious Lack of support, Emails go unanswered. Documentaion is Poor which will force you to call germany. So if you run into a problem prepare to pay the extra $20+ on the phone bill if you don't live nearby. I had tossed the Card and Scandoubler in the Closet, and replaced it with 2 Picasso IV's One for the A4000, and One for the A3000. This had nothing to do with the Cybervision64/3D it is an excellent piece of harware.This was all because of the faulty scandoubler, at least now it gets good use in the A2000, with a Digital Switcher I built Myself. If you Don't have an A4000 you would be better off getting a FlickerFixer, and the Original CyberVision64 which performs a bit better, and will probably cost you a bit less. Also for an extra $20-50 you can get a Picasso IV with a flicker Fixer, and it works on any Amiga with a VideoSlot. If you Have an A4000 and don't really mind the the support issue and, Scandoubled NTSC/PAL then this card with a GOOD 17" or 20" monitor is a spectacular site to see at 1280X1024@75Hz. COPYRIGHT: Knowledge, Words, and this aricle are Free as long as I am credited! Eytan Kaziberdov khyron@total.net --- Accepted and posted by Daniel Barrett, comp.sys.amiga.reviews moderator Send reviews to: amiga-reviews-submissions@math.uh.edu Request information: amiga-reviews-requests@math.uh.edu Moderator mail: amiga-reviews@math.uh.edu Anonymous ftp site: math.uh.edu, in /pub/Amiga/comp.sys.amiga.reviews Web site: http://math.uh.edu/~barrett/reviews.html